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Location: Historical INACCURACIES of the Tudors
Discussion: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most?
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Maggie-AnneB. |
40. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 1 2009, 8:54 PM EST
Ok the worst part that happen in the WHOLE series, is both times Mark Smeaton was tortured. Absolutely horribly! I have to close my eyes and plug my ears whenever I see those scenes. It makes me feel sick. Poor Mark!
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Anne'sCurls |
41. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 1 2009, 11:55 PM EST
I have always had an issue with them changing the dynamics of Charles and Mary's relatioinship. The one true love story at that time and they ruin it just so they can have meaningless sex thrown into the series.
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TillyT2 |
42. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 2 2009, 10:47 AM EST
Worst scene for me was the rape scene - was watching with 84 year old relative. Never. Ever. Again.!
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jmccoy2272 |
43. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 2 2009, 3:03 PM EST
I hated the whole Thomas Boleyn thing at the end when they show him leaving the tower like the weasel he was- that made me kinda sick. The reality is more sick though (who in here said he was hunting with the King while his children were being beheaded by Henry and is that really true??)
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Maggie-AnneB. |
44. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 2 2009, 4:31 PM EST
"I hated the whole Thomas Boleyn thing at the end when they show him leaving the tower like the weasel he was- that made me kinda sick. The reality is more sick though (who in here said he was hunting with the King while his children were being beheaded by Henry and is that really true??)"I think that is true. I heard that too before. I wouldn't put it past Thomas though. To TillyY2... hahah! Do you find this valuable? |
MsSquirrly |
45. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 2 2009, 4:41 PM EST
| Post edited: Mar 2 2009, 4:45 PM EST
Primary sources give no evidence of where Thomas Boleyn was...except to say that he wasn't in London at the time so it is presumed he was at Hever. He was not arrested so the series fabricated the scene where he leaves and Anne watches. He did return to court though and after his wife died...there was talk of him marrying the King';s niece, Margaret Douglas. Check out his profile on the wiki for more info: http://tudorswiki.sho.com/page/Sir+Thomas+Boleyn%2C+Earl+of+Wiltshire
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Boudica |
46. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 2 2009, 5:32 PM EST
"To Boudica's point, I guess I thought from reading here and there that George was gay. If he was, it certainly seemed believable to me that he would #1 feel the need to hide the fact in those days and #2 resent his wife because of his situation and respond in that way. In other words I found the scene realistic and reasonable for George -- who was an ass, after all. Wasn't rape more common at that time when women were seen as merely property? On the other hand I can appreciate gay or bi individuals who don't see enough gay characters in TV as it is, getting frustrated when there is something so negative. Look at it this way, there aren't a lot of nice characters in the show, straight or gay."There's no historical evidence that George Boleyn was intimate with men, that comes from misconstrued court rumours that he and the rest of the Boleyn faction were a bunch of sexual "libertines". Later historical accounts took that to mean the whole nine yards in terms of unorthodox sexuality - but it could have just meant George was just a womanizer, which there was adequate evidence he was. Do you find this valuable? |
karenofbethany |
47. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 2 2009, 5:48 PM EST
The implied homosexuality between George Boleyn and Mark Smeaton. I can't think of any good reason to have put that in there.
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Anne'sCurls |
48. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 2 2009, 6:53 PM EST
"The implied homosexuality between George Boleyn and Mark Smeaton. I can't think of any good reason to have put that in there. "So little freaks like me could see sexy Mark without a shirt Do you find this valuable? |
Walsingham |
49. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 3 2009, 3:15 PM EST
Good thread. The Mary/Margaret confusion is unnecessary to me and could have been addressed much better. But the most egregious one to me is Wolsey's "suicide." A shameful piece of writing - his true end was shown well-played (if fleetingly) in AMFAS by Orson Welles. I am just continually dumbfounded at screenwriters who misuse really fascinating historical characters and actions and feel the need to exercise liberties like this. Making for good plot is one thing - but there is no need here...the characters and true actions are fascinating enough and you insult the knowledgeable viewer when you introduce unncessary falsehoods in the name of dramatic license. IMO, no need to try to improve on history when it is as intriguing as this was - use the cards you've been dealt. They're good ones. Do you find this valuable? |
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MsSquirrly |
50. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 3 2009, 3:38 PM EST
but you know regarding the Wolsey suicide....there is an account by a primary source, Tudor Chronicler Edward Hall who implies that Wolsey did commit suicide:"When the cardinal saw the captain of the guard he was much astonished and shortly became ill, for he foresaw some great trouble, and for that reason men said he willingly took so much strong purgative that his constitution could not bear it. But Sir William Kingston comforted him, and by easy journeys he brought him to the Abbey of Leicester on 27 November, where through weakness caused by purgatives and vomiting he died the second night following, and is buried in the same Abbey." http://englishhistory.net/tudor/priwols1.html Admittedly not as dramatic as slitting his own throat but seemingly not out of the realm of possibility that Wolsey may have killed himself. Do you find this valuable? |
HeroineAddict |
51. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 3 2009, 4:18 PM EST
| Post edited: Mar 3 2009, 4:20 PM EST
"but you know regarding the Wolsey suicide....there is an account by a primary source, Tudor Chronicler Edward Hall who implies that Wolsey did commit suicide:I'd also understood that there was a suggestion that Wolsey did indeed kill himself. I've certainly read in a number of places that the precise nature of his death is mysterious, at least, and that there is evidence (the Edward Hall quote included) that he might have been instrumental in his own end. I've always given them a pass on the Wolsey suicide simply because the specifics of his death are so murky, and that there is still this question mark about it. Do you find this valuable? |
JP25 |
52. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most?
Mar 3 2009, 6:12 PM EST
"Holly2 and I actually talked about this. We brought up how the mother of Charles's son has not been determinded, so if Edward (Charles's son) had a daughter named Jane and she married a man with the last name Grey, there making Lady Jane Grey.Sorry that wouldn't work as poor Lady Jane Grey was forced to marry Guildford Dudley as the Dudleys wanted to keep ruleing through her when they placed her on the throne.So she needs to be single to be free to marry. I think the whole thing with the two sisters is one of the worst inaccurcies that they made, it completely ruins the future time line of the royal family!! Also I don't like that they protrayed Wolsley as having commited suicide as he was a Catholic, Catholics believe that they go to hell if they commit suicide as they have killed one of God's creations. I can't imagine that Wolsley would willing damm himself. Do you find this valuable? |
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karenofbethany |
53. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 3 2009, 7:17 PM EST
"So little freaks like me could see sexy Mark without a shirt"ARe there any other movies we can see sexy Mark in? Do you find this valuable? |
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karenofbethany |
54. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 3 2009, 7:18 PM EST
"I think what ticked me off the most was that they had Wolsey commit suicide. Here I was, innocently expecting him to clutch his heart and fall over in the road, and instead he kills himself. *Sighs* But, if they did have to make him kill himself, at least they did a good job of it with great music behind it!Semper, do you or any of our other experts with spies out there know if there is ANY producer interested in ANY series based on Elizabeth or Mary Queen of Scots? Do you find this valuable? |
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karenofbethany |
55. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most?
Mar 3 2009, 7:20 PM EST
"Sorry that wouldn't work as poor Lady Jane Grey was forced to marry Guildford Dudley as the Dudleys wanted to keep ruleing through her when they placed her on the throne.So she needs to be single to be free to marry.Especially when one of Wolsey's most famous quotes is: "If I had served God as well as I had served the King, I would not be in this place (paraphrased). That leads one to think he made peace with God and died not by his own hand. Do you find this valuable? |
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MsSquirrly |
56. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 3 2009, 7:28 PM EST
"ARe there any other movies we can see sexy Mark in?"oh sure there are....check out David Alpay's profile for a list of other movies: http://tudorswiki.sho.com/page/David+Alpay Do you find this valuable? |
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Walsingham |
57. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most?
Mar 5 2009, 10:56 PM EST
| Post edited: Mar 5 2009, 11:03 PM EST
I had heard of the account implying that Wolsey essentially did something that resulted in his death, but from my readings I had always understood that most historians dismiss the idea of Wolsey committing suicide, and that such ideas were a misinterpretation of some contemporary accounts. But as always there are probably dueling historians and experts.Reminds me a bit of the film King Arthur, where one recent author developed an idea that Arthur may have had 'knights' who were warriors from eastern Europe, and the screenwriters used that approach - though very few historians agree that this was the case (at least not at the right time and context for an Arthurian figure). Do you find this valuable? |
LadyLizzy |
58. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 6 2009, 4:33 AM EST
"Worst scene for me was the rape scene - was watching with 84 year old relative. Never. Ever. Again.!"Completely agreed, Tilly, it was a horrible scene. Also I haven't quite forgiven them "Margaret" (no offence meant against Anwar). It also bugs me that they didn't dye JRM's hair. How are they going to explain Lizzy's hair? After all, he doubted whether she was truly his daughter, but the red hair was the best proof she truly was a Tudor. Even "Margaret" had red hair! Wouldn't have been a big deal. Do you find this valuable? |
Honey-Beezz |
59. RE: What scene of dramatic license on the series bothered you the most
Mar 6 2009, 8:37 AM EST
"lolz ^_^Greensleeves was written for Anne Boleyn when Henry was courting her,Henry was prolific in poems and songs. Of course,Mary/Margaret was one of the worst mistakes they could make in the show,avoiding the fact Henry had two sisters and being very close with Mary;after all,He named a ship the Mary Rose after her.Also,Anne having BLUE eyes,not!!! Do you find this valuable? |
