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Location: Thomas Cromwell, Earl of Essex
Discussion: How soon do you think it will be before Cromwell begins to fall?
Keyword tags:
Cromwell
predictions
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 SemperEadem |
How soon do you think it will be before Cromwell begins to fall?
Jun 3 2008, 1:13 AM EDT From The Tudors Predictions Page How soon in Season 3 do you think Cromwell will begin to fall from grace? Will it happen fairly soon in the season, or dramatically towards the end? 2 out of 3 found this valuable. Do you? |
 QueenCatherine |
RE: How soon do you think it will be before Cromwell begins to fall?
Jun 4 2008, 4:57 PM EDT If they follow an historic timeline, it will really become bad for him with the Anne of the Cleves situation. Henry was not happy with the arrangement and Thomas Cromwell suffered for it. Do you find this valuable? |
 MissAlexsays |
RE: How soon do you think it will be before Cromwell begins to fall?
Jun 4 2008, 9:02 PM EDT It will be interesting because maybe they will show other reasons why he falls from grace besides the Anne of Cleves situation. Do you find this valuable? |
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LovetheTudors LovetheTudors |
What about Norfolk?
Jun 4 2008, 9:20 PM EDT Do you suppose the producers will mollify/persuade Czerny to return as Norfolk since he is so instrumental in Cromwell's downfall and the rise of Katherine Howard? Or do you think they'll get another actor. Or, will they just make someone up?!?! Do you find this valuable? |
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scooter&buster scooter&buster |
RE: What about Norfolk?
Jun 5 2008, 12:01 AM EDT They HAVE to bring Norfolk back. I'd love to have Czerny back, but I think they could get another actor. It has been a whole season since we've seen him as Norfolk, so I think the viewers could accept another actor in the role. The fall of Cromwell is much more complicated than Anne of Cleaves. It has a lot to do with the Pilgrimage of Grace, and the unpopulaity of the dissolution of the monastaries. But, i think it was the Norfolk faction that did the most damage. I'm just shocked Cromwell didn't see it coming. I think he over estimated his power over a fickle king. Also, Henry had just made him Earl of Essex 4 months before his fall. Cromwell must have felt rather secure after being made a noble. Do you find this valuable? |
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scooter&buster scooter&buster |
RE: What about Norfolk?
Jun 5 2008, 12:06 AM EDT Just wanted to add that I read in an article that Jane Seymour lasts until midseason in season 3. If that's the case, I think Cromwell will last up to the finale. They'll probably go out on his execution,, and the beginning of Henry and the doomed Miss Howard. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
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LovetheTudors LovetheTudors |
RE: What about Norfolk?
Jun 5 2008, 8:07 AM EDT Can you tell us where you found this article? I'd love to read it! Do you find this valuable? |
 Mairy |
RE: What about Norfolk?
Jun 5 2008, 10:33 AM EDT " I thought he would have felt an unease at the King requesting he bring his family to court early on in the second season. Personally I wouldn't have entirely trusted the King knowing his past Do you find this valuable? |
 lettice |
RE: What about Norfolk?
Jun 5 2008, 11:09 AM EDT "Just wanted to add that I read in an article that Jane Seymour lasts until midseason in season 3. If that's the case, I think Cromwell will last up to the finale. They'll probably go out on his execution,, and the beginning of Henry and the doomed Miss Howard."Sounds logical. Cromwell meets his demise shortly after the Anne of Cleves debacle. Norfolk should return as he is instrumental in Cromwell's fall. Do you find this valuable? |
 Holly2 |
RE: What about Norfolk?
Jun 5 2008, 3:53 PM EDT "They HAVE to bring Norfolk back. I'd love to have Czerny back, but I think they could get another actor. It has been a whole season since we've seen him as Norfolk, so I think the viewers could accept another actor in the role.Considering that being made Queen didn't save Anne, it would be pretty silly of Cromwell to think that an earldom would make him secure. As Anne pointed out in Season Two, what Henry gives, he can also take away. Could the man who witnessed the falls of Wolsey, More and Anne really have been naive and/or arrogant enough to believe that the same couldn't happen to him? I hope that they don't oversimplify Cromwell's fall by making it a straight case of 'bring Henry a bride he doesn't like and start the Decapitation Countdown'. As you say, I think that there were other factors at play. He definitely made enemies for himself after the dissolution of the monasteries. Do you find this valuable? |
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scooter&buster scooter&buster |
RE: What about Norfolk?
Jun 5 2008, 4:22 PM EDT "Can you tell us where you found this article? I'd love to read it!"Here's the article link: http://www.eonline.com/gossip/kristin/detail/index.jsp?uuid=dccafcbe-a827-45be-a401-8d10848d1cc6 I hope it works. I''m not familar with this board, and not sure how to post links. Do you find this valuable? |
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scooter&buster scooter&buster |
RE: What about Norfolk?
Jun 5 2008, 4:28 PM EDT "That's what I thought when Henry asked him to bring his wife and son to court. Cromwell certainly didn't look all that excited about it. I'd want my family nowhere near H8's person. I'm hoping we see Cromwell's son. It seems we got a glimpse of the wifey. I read that Gregory Cromwell was married to Elizabeth Seymour before Henry ever started wooing Jane. I guess the show isn't going to show the Cromwell/Seymour marriage, which I think is a pity. Do you find this valuable? |
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LovetheTudors LovetheTudors |
RE: Cromwell's Fall
Jun 5 2008, 5:45 PM EDT The series speeded up Cromwell's promotion to the nobility. In actuality, it happened shortly before his death. Henry ennobled him so that Cromwell would be subject to an Act of Attainder...which means your life and property are subject to the desire of the king. It only applied to nobility...so the real H-8 truly toyed with Cromwell. Do you find this valuable? |
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scooter&buster scooter&buster |
RE: Cromwell's Fall
Jun 5 2008, 6:58 PM EDT "The series speeded up Cromwell's promotion to the nobility. In actuality, it happened shortly before his death. Henry ennobled him so that Cromwell would be subject to an Act of Attainder...which means your life and property are subject to the desire of the king. It only applied to nobility...so the real H-8 truly toyed with Cromwell."I don't think Cromwell's been ennobled yet. If he has, I've missed it. Every one still calls him Mr. Secretary. He is Chancellor, but I don't think he's Earl yet. Do you find this valuable? |
 tinitini |
RE: How soon do you think it will be before Cromwell begins to fall?
Jun 6 2008, 1:05 AM EDT "From The Tudors Predictions PageI think that with the fact that they move pretty fast with the stories that it will happen this season for sure. Since Jane Seymour dies 3 weeks after having Edward Henry of course is on the look-out for a new wife even in "mourning." That is one of the things that brings Cromwell down is his involvment of setting Henry up with Anne of Cleves. Maybe it will be a showdown at the end of the coming up season with his head on the chopping block. Katherine Howard would be too much too soon if they want to continue the show. Do you find this valuable? |
 sherrilina |
RE: How soon do you think it will be before Cromwell begins to fall?
Aug 28 2008, 7:07 PM EDT If they follow the same pattern as in the last two seasons, I imagine they would end season 3 with him getting executed in juxtaposition to Henry and Catherine Howard getting married--since they do love their juxtapositions (and the two events I think actually happened on the same day) during the dramatic moments and deaths on the show, and it would be a way to really end the season on a dramatic bang, IMO. Plus it would make sense to end Frain there, and not have to pay him going into season 4.....the only question is whether they'd go that far in season 3, but then Anne of Cleves doesn't really last long anyway.... What do you guys think? As much as I love Frain, I can't wait to see him die--I think he'd do a fantastic job, and would love to see Henry read his final letter to him, as he did with Catherine of Aragon in season 2..... Do you find this valuable? |
 heverhoney |
RE: What about Norfolk?
Aug 28 2008, 8:01 PM EDT "Sounds logical. Cromwell meets his demise shortly after the Anne of Cleves debacle.Norfolk was also instrumental in Anne Boleyn's downfall as he proceeded over the trail in real life...but that still wasn't enough to bring his character back for season 2! Do you find this valuable? |
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heverhoney |
RE: How soon do you think it will be before Cromwell begins to fall?
Aug 28 2008, 8:05 PM EDT "I think that with the fact that they move pretty fast with the stories that it will happen this season for sure. Since Jane Seymour dies 3 weeks after having Edward Henry of course is on the look-out for a new wife even in "mourning." That is one of the things that brings Cromwell down is his involvment of setting Henry up with Anne of Cleves. Maybe it will be a showdown at the end of the coming up season with his head on the chopping block. Katherine Howard would be too much too soon if they want to continue the show."Henry waited 2 and 1/2 years after Jane's death before he married Anne of Cleves..I wonder if the show will acknowledge the time that has lapsed, or if they will make it seem as though he hopped into a new marriage before his "beloved Jane" was cold? 0 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
 LNor19 |
RE: How soon do you think it will be before Cromwell begins to fall?
Aug 28 2008, 8:18 PM EDT "Henry waited 2 and 1/2 years after Jane's death before he married Anne of Cleves..I wonder if the show will acknowledge the time that has lapsed, or if they will make it seem as though he hopped into a new marriage before his "beloved Jane" was cold?"Henry's mourning of Jane was a big thing. While he was estatic he had a son, Henry was said to wear black well into 1538, and from what I've seen in behind the scene picture JRM is certainly donning black clothing. Also Henry gained his weight upon Jane's death, whether or not they show it. But they could show his further mental slide with Jane's death. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
