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Queen Katherine of Aragon Controversies

Historical Controversies about Queen Katherine of Aragon who was described by contemporaries as *"more beloved than any queen who ever reigned"* Click EasyEdit to edit/add this page! (Don't see the EasyEdit button above? Sign in or Sign up.)

Historical Controversies
about Queen Katherine of Aragon

who was described by contemporaries as

"more beloved than any queen who ever reigned"

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Was Katherine's first marriage to Prince Arthur Tudor consummated? Here are the known facts, at the time of marriage, Arthur was 14 years old and Katherine just shy of 16 years old. Prior to the marriage, Arthur had stated that he found his new wife to be pleasing to him and that he was feeling ‘lusty and amorous.’ It was also perfectly acceptable for two people of such a young age to be married and engage in sexual intercourse. Tudor Historian David Starkey in his book Six Wives describes how the couple were put to bed which was customary for the day and says: "What happened then, only God knows.The herald, a strictly contemporary witness, assumed that nature had taken its course. 'And thus these worthy persons concluded and consummate the effect and complement of matrimony'. Many of those present, when questioned thirty years later, asserted the same. George Talbot, the Earl of Shrewsbury, remembered accompanying Arthur to the wedding chamber and leaving him there. The Earl said he had consummated his own marriage at fifteen. Arthur was a similar age, and he took for granted that Arthur has done so too. The Marquess of Dorset recollected Arthur getting into the bed where the Lady Catherine lay under the coverlet 'as the manner is of Queens in that behalf'. He likewise, assumed that the marriage was consummated since Arthur was 'of good and sanguine complexion' - that is fit and healthy. But Catherine was to tell a very different story. The Morning after: There had been hot competition to be part of Arthur's wedding-night party. One of those who struck lucky was Sir Anthony Willoughby, a body servant of Arthur's. He was sneaked in by his father, Lord Broke, the Lord Steward of the Household and Catherine's escort on her journey from the west country. The morning after, Willoughby claimed, Arthur had boasted of his exploits. 'Willoughby', he had ordered, 'bring me a cup of ale for I have been this night in the midst of Spain'. There were, Willoughby asserted, several witnesses to the remark. Later, the Prince had said openly, 'Masters, it is good pastime to have a wife'. The words stuck in men's memories, as well they might, and at least one other witness confirmed the story. Memories? False memories? Or downright lies? Whatever had or had not happened on the wedding night, Catherine and Arthur had plenty of time to recover from their exertions. Catherine spent the day following, Monday 15 November, in strict solitude receiving no one, save Oxford who brought a warmly paternal message from her father-in-law. On the Tuesday, the King, the Prince and the Duke of York [Henry VIII] processed solemnly back to St. Paul's to give thanks to God 'that so prosperously His goodness had suffered everything of this laudable [marriage] to be brought to its most laudable conclusion.' For this ceremony, roles were reversed and it was Catherine's turn to watch from the privacy of the Closet on the north side of the nave. Afterwards, she received Henry VII in her lodgings and father- and daughter-in-law exchanged 'right pleasant and favourable words, salutes and communications'. That day, too, at dinner she was served for the first time as an English Princess, not as a Spanish Infanta. Would all this have been done if the marriage had not been consummated? Would Catherine have behaved as she did?" The young couple shortly after the marriage moved to Wales where they took up their duties as Prince and Princess of Wales at Ludlow Castle. There they remained for six months until Arthur’s death. If Arthur was so weak and sickly why would he be sent to live at the drafty, cold, remote castle? It was after his death, with the help of her duenna Doña Elvira, that Katherine was able to say the marriage had not been consummated. (However Katherine and her duenna were never close, and she ended up betraying Katherine later in life.) Some historians say that Arthur was frail. What evidence they have is not clear other than he wasn’t a great sportsman. The causes of his death are really unknown, and have been attributed to the ’sweating sickness’ that claimed many lives during that time. Others who believe the marriage was consummated say Arthur expired from overexertion. Whatever the uncertainty is, a pregnancy did not result from her short marriage to Arthur, and she became pregnant almost immediately upon wedding Henry VIII. We don’t know if Henry thought she was a virgin on their wedding night or not. We do know that in order to set her aside after many years of marriage so he could wed another, that he did believe she had consummated her marriage with Arthur. Many say that because Katherine was such a pious woman that she would never lie about whether there had been a consummation with Arthur. Therefore, if she said she didn’t, then she didn’t. However she was also a very smart woman and she knew that if she conceded to having consummated her marriage with Arthur that she could indeed be set aside. This would mean that her daughter and heir to the throne would be claimed illegitimate and her marriage to Henry VIII annulled. There is no way, she would have admitted to such a thing, knowing how it would hurt her daughter’s future.

Inability to Provide a Living Male Heir:: Some historians have said that Katherine had as many as 10 pregnancies but only 6 are confirmed by primary sources. They are as follows: 31 January 1510 she gave birth to an unnamed daughter who was stillborn. 1 January 1511 she gave birth to a son, Henry, who was given the title Duke of Cornwall. He died, only 52 days old. November 1513, another son named Henry was born, and lived only a few hours. December 1514, A stillborn, unnamed daughter was born. 18th February 1516, the only child to survive infancy, Princess Mary Tudor was born 10 November 1518, Katherine's final pregnancy produced another unnamed, stillborn daughter After the first miscarriage in January 31, 1510 and this was documented by her physician who reported her menstrual cycle returning, she seemed to have either a phantom pregnancy or some kind of infection. Her belly continued to grow and she thought she was still pregnant. She took to her chambers in March to await the birth. It both L&P, vol. I i, 394 and the Spanish Calendar - Supplements to volumes I and II. All the English - Spanish official correspondence stated that the miscarriage of a daughter, which took place on January 31, was recorded by Katherine of Aragon's confessor, Fray Diego. He stated she had no warning except for a pain in her knee the night before; she was then brought to bed, and delivered of a six months developed daughter. The confessor, two Spanish ladies in waiting, the physician knew about it - the King was immediately informed. There is no doubt as to this miscarriage. Apparently, the physician claimed "the Queen remained pregnant of another child and it was believed" even after her menstrual cycles resumed, the charade continued on for three months, until Katherine retired to her chambers to await the birth. Apparently, the new Spanish Ambassador, Luiz Caroz, although not having heard about the January miscarriage upon arrival in England, somehow doubted the Queen was actually pregnant - he'd heard her cycles had resumed, and was astonished at how all had been duped into thinking a menstruating woman could possibly be pregnant. Both Diego and Caroz sent full accounts of this bizarre situation back to Spain. Fray Diego, in late March, reported "it has pleased our Lord to be her physician in such a way that the swelling decreased". Katherine remained in seclusion until late May. In May, Katherine of Aragon sent her father a letter stating she miscarried of a daughter "some days before", and that "her child was still born is considered to be a misfortune in England . . . do not be angry with me, for it has been the will of God." It was also recorded that Henry was angry with the queen regarding this situation when she came out of seclusion.

Was Katherine's first marriage to Prince Arthur Tudor consummated?

Here are the known facts, at the time of marriage, Arthur was 14 years old and Katherine just shy of 16 years old. Prior to the marriage, Arthur had stated that he found his new wife to be pleasing to him and that he was feeling ‘lusty and amorous.’ It was also perfectly acceptable for two people of such a young age to be married and engage in sexual intercourse.

Queen Katherine of Aragon Controversies - The Tudors Wiki

Tudor Historian David Starkey in his book Six Wives describes how the couple were put to bed which was customary for the day and says:

"What happened then, only God knows.The herald, a strictly contemporary witness, assumed that nature had taken its course. 'And thus these worthy persons concluded and consummate the effect and complement of matrimony'. Many of those present, when questioned thirty years later, asserted the same. George Talbot, the Earl of Shrewsbury, remembered accompanying Arthur to the wedding chamber and leaving him there. The Earl said he had consummated his own marriage at fifteen. Arthur was a similar age, and he took for granted that Arthur has done so too. The Marquess of Dorset recollected Arthur getting into the bed where the Lady Catherine lay under the coverlet 'as the manner is of Queens in that behalf'. He likewise, assumed that the marriage was consummated since Arthur was 'of good and sanguine complexion' - that is fit and healthy. But Catherine was to tell a very different story.

The Morning after: There had been hot competition to be part of Arthur's wedding-night party. One of those who struck lucky was Sir Anthony Willoughby, a body servant of Arthur's. He was sneaked in by his father, Lord Broke, the Lord Steward of the Household and Catherine's escort on her journey from the west country. The morning after, Willoughby claimed, Arthur had boasted of his exploits. 'Willoughby', he had ordered, 'bring me a cup of ale for I have been this night in the midst of Spain'. There were, Willoughby asserted, several witnesses to the remark. Later, the Prince had said openly, 'Masters, it is good pastime to have a wife'. The words stuck in men's memories, as well they might, and at least one other witness confirmed the story.
Memories? False memories? Or downright lies?

Whatever had or had not happened on the wedding night, Catherine and Arthur had plenty of time to recover from their exertions. Catherine spent the day following, Monday 15 November, in strict solitude receiving no one, save Oxford who brought a warmly paternal message from her father-in-law. On the Tuesday, the King, the Prince and the Duke of York [Henry VIII] processed solemnly back to St. Paul's to give thanks to God 'that so prosperously His goodness had suffered everything of this laudable [marriage] to be brought to its most laudable conclusion.' For this ceremony, roles were reversed and it was Catherine's turn to watch from the privacy of the Closet on the north side of the nave. Afterwards, she received Henry VII in her lodgings and father- and daughter-in-law exchanged 'right pleasant and favourable words, salutes and communications'. That day, too, at dinner she was served for the first time as an English Princess, not as a Spanish Infanta.

Would all this have been done if the marriage had not been consummated? Would Catherine have behaved as she did?"

The young couple shortly after the marriage moved to Wales where they took up their duties as Prince and Princess of Wales at Ludlow Castle. There they remained for six months until Arthur’s death. If Arthur was so weak and sickly why would he be sent to live at the drafty, cold, remote castle? It was after his death, with the help of her duenna Doña Elvira, that Katherine was able to say the marriage had not been consummated. (However Katherine and her duenna were never close, and she ended up betraying Katherine later in life.)

Some historians say that Arthur was frail. What evidence they have is not clear other than he wasn’t a great sportsman. The causes of his death are really unknown, and have been attributed to the ’sweating sickness’ that claimed many lives during that time. Others who believe the marriage was consummated say Arthur expired from overexertion.

Whatever the uncertainty is, a pregnancy did not result from her short marriage to Arthur, and she became pregnant almost immediately upon wedding Henry VIII. We don’t know if Henry thought she was a virgin on their wedding night or not. We do know that in order to set her aside after many years of marriage so he could wed another, that he did believe she had consummated her marriage with Arthur.

Many say that because Katherine was such a pious woman that she would never lie about whether there had been a consummation with Arthur. Therefore, if she said she didn’t, then she didn’t. However she was also a very smart woman and she knew that if she conceded to having consummated her marriage with Arthur that she could indeed be set aside. This would mean that her daughter and heir to the throne would be claimed illegitimate and her marriage to Henry VIII annulled. There is no way, she would have admitted to such a thing, knowing how it would hurt her daughter’s future.

Inability to Provide a Living Male Heir::
Some historians have said that Katherine had as many as 10 pregnancies but only 6 are confirmed by primary sources.

They are as follows:

31 January 1510 she gave birth to an unnamed daughter who was stillborn.
1 January 1511 she gave birth to a son, Henry, who was given the title Duke of Cornwall. He died, only 52 days old.
November 1513, another son named Henry was born, and lived only a few hours. December 1514, A stillborn, unnamed daughter was born.
18th February 1516, the only child to survive infancy, Princess Mary Tudor was born
10 November 1518, Katherine's final pregnancy produced another unnamed, stillborn daughter

After the first miscarriage in January 31, 1510 and this was documented by her physician who reported her menstrual cycle returning, she seemed to have either a phantom pregnancy or some kind of infection. Her belly continued to grow and she thought she was still pregnant. She took to her chambers in March to await the birth.

It both L&P, vol. I i, 394 and the Spanish Calendar - Supplements to volumes I and II. All the English - Spanish official correspondence stated that the miscarriage of a daughter, which took place on January 31, was recorded by Katherine of Aragon's confessor, Fray Diego. He stated she had no warning except for a pain in her knee the night before; she was then brought to bed, and delivered of a six months developed daughter. The confessor, two Spanish ladies in waiting, the physician knew about it - the King was immediately informed. There is no doubt as to this miscarriage.

Apparently, the physician claimed "the Queen remained pregnant of another child and it was believed" even after her menstrual cycles resumed, the charade continued on for three months, until Katherine retired to her chambers to await the birth. Apparently, the new Spanish Ambassador, Luiz Caroz, although not having heard about the January miscarriage upon arrival in England, somehow doubted the Queen was actually pregnant - he'd heard her cycles had resumed, and was astonished at how all had been duped into thinking a menstruating woman could possibly be pregnant.

Both Diego and Caroz sent full accounts of this bizarre situation back to Spain.

Fray Diego, in late March, reported "it has pleased our Lord to be her physician in such a way that the swelling decreased". Katherine remained in seclusion until late May.

In May, Katherine of Aragon sent her father a letter stating she miscarried of a daughter "some days before", and that "her child was still born is considered to be a misfortune in England . . . do not be angry with me, for it has been the will of God." It was also recorded that Henry was angry with the queen regarding this situation when she came out of seclusion.

LINKS: David Starkey on Katherine of Aragon's marriage to Prince Arthur	SOURCES: The Divorce of Catherine of Aragon by A.J.Froude The alleged miscarriages of Catherine of Aragon and Anne Boleyn. by J Dewhurst

LINKS:

David Starkey on Katherine of Aragon's marriage to Prince Arthur

SOURCES:

MsSquirrly	Latest page update: made by MsSquirrly , Aug 1 2009, 12:02 AM EDT (about this update About This Update Moved from: Queen Katherine of Aragon - MsSquirrly No content added or deleted. - complete history)
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CatalinaAragon

CatalinaAragon

Jul 27 2009, 11:35 AM EDT by hohumpigsbum

Thread started: Jul 27 2009, 11:26 AM EDT Watch

I read Antonia Fraser and others historians. I think that Catherine said THE TRUTH for several reasons. For example , Henry VIII never denied in the trial the Catherine's virginity and was easy to deny it.

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chineyes

QUEEN KATHERINE

Feb 21 2009, 4:05 PM EST by juliana-angela

Thread started: Feb 13 2009, 11:03 AM EST Watch

QueenKatherine of Aragon (her first marriage was not consummated because her husband king arthur died of the sweating fevers .Queen Katherine could not have a son because she stop bleeding and the ones she did have were born dead.

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